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Mango
July 18th, 2014, 11:20
Hey all,

I have a 1st grade class (JHS) that is er... troublesome, to describe them kindly. There's a few students who are good and will try but the rest just screech and do their usual things (talking, walking, screaming, etc). Usually not an issue with classes like these, but the JTE has terrible control. She'll scream at them constantly (to the point where she'll lose her voice half way through) and they'll mock her back for it. I've tried to stay quiet, look angry, talk to the teacher, nothing works. When I do have a little control, the JTE talks over me and takes the reins. All her classes are like that, but this one is the worst. The other issue is that the JTE is also my supervisor, so I feel like I need to tread as politely as possible (and I'd really like to be re-contracted next year!). So! I'd like to know what those of you who may have (or had) a class like this do(did)? And how do I deal with the JTE? She continuously talks over me and changes things on the fly- then gets annoyed when I can't keep up. =/

Thankfully today's the last day of classes before summer break, but I'd like to be prepared for when school starts up again in August!

Thanks in advance! =)

BeckyJones
July 18th, 2014, 12:02
maybe not the answer you are looking for but...

nothing. It is on her, and she has lost the class. You shouldn't attempt to take control over her, unless that somehows seems doable and the teacher is willing, which in this situation it doesn't appear to be. The only suggestion I would give you is to ask the VP to come and watch the class. And That is only a way to prove that "you are not at fault".

Antonath
July 18th, 2014, 12:08
Bunky is correct: discipline is ultimately the job of the JTE, and if they've lost control to the extent you say, the class is a lost cause. The suggestion of having your VP observe a class is definitely a good one for ass-covering, but the chances are they already know the class is bad, so I wouldn't hope for change. As the JTE is also your advisor, you need to be somewhat careful, but do remember that your supervisor at the school (the one who actually has power over you rather than being there to help) is generally your Principal.

Jiggit
July 18th, 2014, 12:25
discipline is ultimately the job of the JTE


If you rely on the JTE doing their job, you're gonna have a bad time.

uthinkimlost?
July 18th, 2014, 12:28
It may be the JTE's job, but if you are capable of taking control and don't because it isn't in your job description, you're screwing the kids, not the JTE.

Why are the students losing it?

Antonath
July 18th, 2014, 12:38
If you rely on the JTE doing their job, you're gonna have a bad time.
Agreed, but the ALT's control over the class is inherited from the JTE. If the JTE has any control at all, the ALT usually has some power. If, as this case seems to be, the JTE has nothing, nor does the ALT.

Uthink, I agree that if the ALT can take control and doesn't, they're screwing the kids. From what we've heard so far, I don't think Mango stands much of a chance of taking control (no offense intended; any ALT would have little chance in that environment).

Ini
July 18th, 2014, 12:43
What are they like in other classes? If its just English then you may stand a chance but if they are bad in general they trying to discipline them is a terrible idea. All that will happen is they will turn on you and its much better to work in a shit school and be loved by the students than to work in a shit school and be hated.

Jiggit
July 18th, 2014, 12:44
What are they like in other classes? If its just English then you may stand a chance but if they are bad in general they trying to discipline them is a terrible idea. All that will happen is they will turn on you and its much better to work in a shit school and be loved by the students than to work in a shit school and be hated.

Right.

uthinkimlost?
July 18th, 2014, 13:09
Agreed, but the ALT's control over the class is inherited from the JTE. If the JTE has any control at all, the ALT usually has some power. If, as this case seems to be, the JTE has nothing, nor does the ALT.

Uthink, I agree that if the ALT can take control and doesn't, they're screwing the kids. From what we've heard so far, I don't think Mango stands much of a chance of taking control (no offense intended; any ALT would have little chance in that environment).


When I say 'take control,' I don't really mean dsicipline them, or rule with an iron fist. -but if you can distract and redirect at the right time you can sometimes have a chance to stop complete derailment.


That's why I'm asking at what point they lose their shit. If it happens as soon as the JTE shows up, show up earlier. Tell the JTE you want to get the kids warmed up for the class. If it happens at a cue, find the cue. If it is just a few students leading the class astray, see what they're looking for.

skinning cats and all that.

Mango
July 18th, 2014, 13:35
Thanks for all the help! The class as far as I know has a bad rep- the whole grade does (they flooded one of the elementary schools they went to last year), but this one is one of the worst.

uthinkimlost?- It depends on the day. Sometimes they lose it as soon as the JTE shows up, and sometimes after. The teacher currently has a broken foot, so she can't physically do much either. I've been successful in getting some of the problem students to be my helpers in 2 of her other classes, but for this class nothing has worked. I'm honestly not sure what makes them lose it- unfortunately my grasp of Japanese is rather weak, but from what I gather they're just a noisy and active class and need to somehow (for some students at least!) redirect their energy elsewhere, and a firm hand. The other few need to be put elsewhere. =/

Ini- I'm not totally sure. Other classes from what I've seen just walking around they're noisy, but not as unmanageable. Granted this was also little peeks into class, so probably not a great indicator.

Everyone else- I'll try to talk to the VP, but I think I may wait until things get worse? I really don't want to make this a huge, huge deal, as ah, the teacher may have some mental health issues (as mentioned in few English meetings), so her schedule changes sometimes without warning- so maybe that makes them act out too?

Antonath- Thanks! I actually didn't know that. The way it was told to me was the principal and supervisor have the same amount of power over me and then the BOE.

Thank you again, everyone!

BeckyJones
July 18th, 2014, 14:11
Everyone else- I'll try to talk to the VP, but I think I may wait until things get worse? I really don't want to make this a huge, huge deal, as ah, the teacher may have some mental health issues (as mentioned in few English meetings), so her schedule changes sometimes without warning- so maybe that makes them act out too?


there's your problem. You are treating these children like humans. they are not, they are jackals. They smell blood, and they are pouncing on her and you. It doesn't matter, she has shown her true colors as weak, and therefor they will continue to attack. Getting the VP doesn't have to be a big thing. or out like you are underminding the authority of the JTE. Just casually bring it up. Ask him to watch a class (unannounced) and ask for pointers on what to do.

welcome to the Japanese world of office politics, Honne and Tatemae.
in reality you want the VP to watch the horrible little shits and either discipline them, or the teacher.
what you are saying is "I want to make mahself a better teacher, Please VP (stroke some ego) come and watch my class and offer me advice"
do this
and no one will be the wiser. outside of those who know. The VP will know what is up when he sees the class... and during your "advice session" one on one you can really talk discipline


other suggestion would be to buy a stun gun.

Antonath
July 18th, 2014, 14:26
Antonath- Thanks! I actually didn't know that. The way it was told to me was the principal and supervisor have the same amount of power over me and then the BOE.
That might be ESID, of course, but the school hierarchy alone puts the principal higher than a JTE, should they have differing opinions on re-hiring you, for instance.

therealwindycity
July 18th, 2014, 16:10
Generally my advice for terribly-behaved kids:

1080p HD in the Rain (1952) - YouTube (http://youtube.com/watch?v=SND3v0i9uhE)