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Laura
May 10th, 2004, 08:43
Found an interesting link http://everything2.com/?node_id=1536242

To summarise: All Japanese men are assholes. All Japanese women are easy, and all Western men find it easy to get them.

Laura
May 10th, 2004, 08:52
Hey, I didn't write it! :oops:

cottamg
May 11th, 2004, 00:29
heh.... yeah.. I've read that and several others..

you really should try reading these.. (not sure if it balances the argument but it does make for amusing reading. :)

Gareth


http://www.debito.org/residentspage.html#MYTHS - just random stuff

http://www.debito.org/residentspage.html#survivalstrategies

"GENDER ISSUES IN JAPAN
A woman on the now-defunct Dead Fukuzawa Society network comments on the disparity between the treatment of foreign males and foreign females by Japanese society. In her view, the gaijin guy enjoys a sexual playground with abundant Japanese girlfriends, while the gaijin gal faces famine in her love life. The debate heats up with remarkable sentiments that Japanese women are to blame for this--as conniving competitors snapping up men who either don't know any better or are "losers" in their own societies. In a post designed to elicit comment, I claim that while the feast and famine phonomena are certainly true, there is some fault to be assigned the American women (the only ones I can comment on from experience) for their own state of affairs. A contentious trio of essays not to be read if you are either in a good or a bad mood."

and then follow this link to read more... and keep going :)

http://www.debito.org/genderissues.html

sorry about the copy and pasting.. but hey... it's worth the read.

yabighoor
May 11th, 2004, 06:11
Hey, I won't be really bothered about a famine...japanese men too small and i hear that asian men have the smallest (ahem!)

HappyJadeBuddha
May 11th, 2004, 08:09
It's really simple. If you are a decent-looking female, you won't have any problems getting some action. If you're a fat white cow, your only bedmate will be a mukade.

As for fat bearded guys who make their own chain mail and watch hentai, they'll be in hog heaven. I believe it's called "from zero to hero" syndrome.

Any unwanted foreign women can come visit me. We'll play Stratego and drink Zima all night long.

NSboarderchic
May 11th, 2004, 13:43
And considering your *very* tasteful pic, happyjadebudda, I definitely will make sure to visit you this next year.

maya
May 11th, 2004, 14:07
Charming conversation so far :lol:

I have met a few Japanese males here in Australia and the same thing they all say is that the Japanese males are very shy when it comes to western women and that we will have to make the first move. But beware they are very possessive!! from what I have read and heard. I don't think I will bother with the Japanese males since there are so many foreigners in Japan anyways, but if I meet a nice one it all good too! :wink:

philmine1
May 11th, 2004, 20:00
Why are you so worried when this board is full of sexy men? Ahem...

You don't need those J-boys honey, Happyjadebuddha is all the man you could ever want, that goes for all you ladies.


Phil

Chiara
May 11th, 2004, 21:06
I dont want to go to Japan and only have relationships (see my plural there? optimism!!) with Western guys...hell, I can do that in the UK!


the same thing they all say is that the Japanese males are very shy when it comes to western women and that we will have to make the first move

too right! my ex is Japanese, totally gorgeous and the guitarist in a getting-quite-famous punk band...i spent months thinking that he didn't like me at all whereas he just didn't think that he would be able to approach a "Western" woman... it took a lot of boozes before that particular relationship came to pass ;)

mistress_pooky
May 11th, 2004, 22:30
I guess I really don't see what the problem is. Everyone has different tastes, even the Japanese guys. My experience with the japanese men is that they usually went for the more volumptuous western women than the stick-thin ones. Tastes vary, i suppose.

HappyJadeBuddha
May 12th, 2004, 00:00
And considering your *very* tasteful pic, happyjadebudda, I definitely will make sure to visit you this next year.


Sorry, I don't date snow bunnies.

Dynamis
May 12th, 2004, 00:33
It looks more like a fat green worm to me.

NSboarderchic
May 12th, 2004, 02:10
And considering your *very* tasteful pic, happyjadebudda, I definitely will make sure to visit you this next year.


Sorry, I don't date snow bunnies.

Ohhhh... ouch. Well, at least we're in agreement then. Too bad, as I was secretly looking forward to dressing up as an angel and having you blast beams of light on me as I went down on you. Sigh.....

philmine1
May 12th, 2004, 02:21
Did I ever mention how much I'm into snow bunnies?

HappyJadeBuddha
May 12th, 2004, 03:44
Ohhhh... ouch. Well, at least we're in agreement then. Too bad, as I was secretly looking forward to dressing up as an angel and having you blast beams of light on me as I went down on you. Sigh.....


Sorry, but the deal was Stratego and Zima, not lousy head. I can compromise though. How about we sit around in the sun naked and spit betel nut juice on each other until we're stained red?

NSboarderchic
May 12th, 2004, 13:38
Did I ever mention how much I'm into snow bunnies?

Did i ever mention that I board in a powder blue coat with matching beanie and pink goggles and spend most of my day in the lodge checking out guy boarders? ;)

happyjadebuddha - ummmm.... tempting, but I hate to admit that the Zima did sound mighty tasty.

philmine1
May 12th, 2004, 23:37
Did I ever mention how much I'm into snow bunnies?

Did i ever mention that I board in a powder blue coat with matching beanie and pink goggles and spend most of my day in the lodge checking out guy boarders? ;)


You pervert.

NSboarderchic
May 13th, 2004, 13:30
Did I ever mention how much I'm into snow bunnies?

Did i ever mention that I board in a powder blue coat with matching beanie and pink goggles and spend most of my day in the lodge checking out guy boarders? ;)


You pervert.

Dammit!! You figured me out. Now I'm going to have to get a new log-in name *hangs head in shame*

kellicopter
May 14th, 2004, 21:37
So this is my opinion the whole thing

I lived in Taiwan for 3 years and from what I have read about Japan and the situation foreign women find themselves in, it seems to be similar

The foreign guys are occupied with the local women and the local guys are not (or don’t seem to be) interested in foreign women. I think there are many factors that contribute to the above 2 situations which I won’t go into

So where does this leave the foreign women?
Well, unfortunately, this becomes a vicious cirle.What I mean is that I truly believe that your attitude about yourself plays a huge role in how attractive you are. So the foreign women finds herself in a situation where the opposite sex( both foreign and local) do not seem to find her attractive, which often has a negative impact on her self-image. This negative impact changes her attitude about herself and she, therefore, does begin to lose some of her sex appeal... And so the vicious circle continues

However, I am a strong believer in the power of the mind and I know this can work another way as well.

I am a South African that has lived in Asian for over 4 years, so effectively I have lived in Western, African and Asian socities.In each one my “beauty” is seen differently. So for me all Taiwan did was reinforce my belief that beauty is relative.
When it came to my self-esteem, I tried to just concentrate on myself and what I thought was beautiful and stopped relying on what other ppl thought.( of course this is easier said than done), In a way I found being in Asia quite a freeing experience as I stopped worrying about how other ppl defined my attractiveness
Ironically. It actually turned out that I had a much more active dating life (foreign and local) in Asian than any where else.

I am hoping to carry this attitude with me to Japan.

Sorry this post is so long and “preachy” but I feel this will be a big issue for foreign women in Japan and it should be spoken about and this is a great supportive forum in which to do it.

So ladies (and men, too) let me know what you think.

kell

philmine1
May 14th, 2004, 21:46
Kell, you are an absolute legend and possibly the nicest person I've never met :wink: I doubt you'll have any dating problems in Japan.

I don't like the thought of J-girls wanting to go out with me "because I'm foreign", very shallow and I would not stand for it. Its gonna be just as weird for us blokes as for you ladies, but its gonna be fun!

HappyJadeBuddha
May 14th, 2004, 23:45
I don't like the thought of J-girls wanting to go out with me "because I'm foreign", very shallow and I would not stand for it. Its gonna be just as weird for us blokes as for you ladies, but its gonna be fun!


Of course it's shallow, but isn't all dating? Isn't it a game for both parties? Recognize it for what it is and have fun. You don't have to get emotionally attached. And if J-girls are only dating you because you're foreign, so what? At least you know their motive. If you know their motive, and compound that with a language and culture barrier, you have the potential for some strange and exciting times. I say "go for it," but don't let it be the focal point for your entire Japan experience. As the saying goes, "Bros before hos." You should leave ample time for fishing in a drunken stupor off a sea wall with your mates. Huzzah.

philmine1
May 14th, 2004, 23:59
Dating is a game duffy. I love dating but I'm a very strange specimen; I only date girls to get to know them better and not to get into their undies (no doubt the girls you date go commando anyway :wink: )

The fact I had an amazing 3 year relationship when I was 16 while all my friends were screwing around and hurting themselves and other people has left me with the innability to have one night stands or go out with girls I'm not interested in, not sure its a good thing, but it's the way it is.

I'm sure there's nice girls in Japan, and if not, there's always Italy! mmmm....

Bros before hos indeed, very few women can compete with a night out with the boys.

Benito

HappyJadeBuddha
May 15th, 2004, 00:13
Dating is a game duffy. I love dating but I'm a very strange specimen; I only date girls to get to know them better and not to get into their undies (no doubt the girls you date go commando anyway :wink: )


Benito


I don't want to come off sounding like a whoremonger (i love that word). I'm not a whoremonger, though I am a commando.

I'm just saying, if all you have around you are shallow J-girls, either make due with shallow dating, or don't.

As for nights out with the mates, I've never had that much fun with a girl. No woman can compete to the drunken foulness associated with one's mates.

dobharrison
May 15th, 2004, 00:40
As for nights out with the mates, I've never had that much fun with a girl. No woman can compete to the drunken foulness associated with one's mates.

They're very different and often I'm in the mood for a quiet romantic night out. I wouldn't say either is better, they're both wonderful and important.

Going on a date is one of the most 'fun' things I have done! Climbing Everest could not compare to the sheer fear and rush of adrenaline I get when I think someone may like me. I hope that doesn't diminish as I get older!

Don't forget, some girls are capable of drunken foulness too! No one I know, of course...

Petesmp
May 15th, 2004, 04:17
Although it may seem backwards to us as "Westerners" it's their culture. There are lots of things that Asians think are strange about our culture. It's important to realize that we are guests in their country and not to judge. This applies to many aspects of Japanese life. As "Westerners", esspecially Americans, we tend to not be open minded to other cultures because most Americans tend to think that our country is the center of the universe.

Also I would like to add that things are changing in Japan, but things are still different. And you have to respect that culture. Even if you think it is "wrong".

cottamg
May 15th, 2004, 12:23
Although it may seem backwards to us as "Westerners" it's their culture. There are lots of things that Asians think are strange about our culture. It's important to realize that we are guests in their country and not to judge. This applies to many aspects of Japanese life. As "Westerners", esspecially Americans, we tend to not be open minded to other cultures because most Americans tend to think that our country is the center of the universe.

Also I would like to add that things are changing in Japan, but things are still different. And you have to respect that culture. Even if you think it is "wrong".

IMHO I think you should get rid of the "guest" mindset. Keep an open mind yes, but something that is "wrong" is still wrong even if it is acceptable in another culture. We are going to Japan as not just teachers of English but to exchange culture as well.

Now I'm not advocating going there and trying to impose my culture on them, but I believe (and this is just my opinion) that there is nothing wrong with being true to yourself. If something bothers you, etc, tell them. Don't just say "well, I'm just a guest here."

Anyway, just my 5 cents....

oh and if you are interested, there are some great essays on all sorts of topics here: http://www.debito.org/residentspage.html

the survival strategies in particular are great, I think I mentioned the Gender Issues section already?

cottamg
May 15th, 2004, 12:46
Sorry to go so off topic.....

but just to give an example of what I mean before I get flamed. (Once again taken from the same website).
http://www.debito.org/japantodaycolumns1-3.html
**He (Dave) is a naturalised Japanese (previously Amercian) and speaks fluent Japanese.

" Swimming my thrice-weekly mile in the local pool, I saw an old man expectorating on our lane line.

Sez I: "Oi! Spit in the gutter over there! I don't wanna snort your snot!"

He later cornered me in the shower room for a lecture on Japanese pool etiquette, which apparently permitted him loogie-ing at will. "I don't know how it is in your country..."

No prizes for guessing my reply.

That gave him pause, but his indignation hadn't sufficiently deflated. "But in Japan, we don't scold our elders like that..."

Interjection: "If you are going to ascribe behavior to nationality, I will not talk to you. I don't care how old you are. If you are unsanitary in a public facility I will have words. You might as well pee in the pool. At least the gutter is closer than the toilet."

Eventually we talked this out: There is an outflow drain by the lane line hook, and he did in fact splash his backwash into it. I apologized, and we left mutually piece-of-minded.

"

Anri
May 20th, 2004, 11:12
If foriegn girls in Japan want to date, do what I did--date non-Western foriegners. Koreans and Chinese seem to be more outspoken and willing to date outside their cultural sphere (esp. in Japan)

colleenyb
May 21st, 2004, 07:44
Yes, I'm sure all the guys will have no problem getting lots of girls in Japan. I think there is a bad case of 'zero to hero' syndrome here in the US as well. One of my friend's neighbors is actually a 43 year old man who did JET for three years when he was younger and since that time refuses to date non-Asian women because of the royal treatment he got. Of course, he is a complete loser and I doubt any woman who could speak fluent English would consider dating him.

As for us ladies.... I'm not worried at all. I recently met an awesome Japanese guy during a one month trip to Hawaii. He was a blast. They're lightweights- give them a couple of beers and they'll be all over you! I plan on wooing them all with my kareoke abilities. No, I'm kidding, but I honestly think we'll be fine if we're optimistic about it and learn to laugh at ourselves. Of course, I'm a very outgoing girl and I've got a thing for foreign men. I see it as part of the cultural experience. Of course, I'll be meeting foreign men from other English speaking countries as well.....

HappyJadeBuddha
May 21st, 2004, 12:55
you're no better than the guy who only dates asians.


and the fact you have to get japanese guys drunk to fuck you says an awful lot.

Bron
May 21st, 2004, 12:58
right on coleenyb!
I'm not prepared to write anyone off before I've even given them a chance! I'm open to new experiences, good and bad. The bad ones just help you to really appreciate the good ones I think, so it's all worth it.

If I start to forget what it's like to be with a guy, then I'll worry!

koitten
May 21st, 2004, 17:38
Ladies, from experience, go in knowing it's highly possible there'll be no dating. But get to know lots of people, foreign and local, and have fun just being plutonic. Like anywhere, there are some gems out there.

I was pleasantly surprised when I was hooked up by Japanese friends with a Japanese guy whose more Polynesian looking than Japanese. Actually, he kind of pursued me, and I was oblivious for a few months, in search of a foreigner. We had great times. Unfortunately, his maintaining the relationship skills are lacking.

Yes, the Japanese women tend to use foreign men (many of them the not-so-desireable at home) as ornaments. Though some relationships are genuine.

"I will survive...As long as I know how to love I know I'll stay alive..." There's nothing like a night out with the girls at the karaoke bar!

Beq
May 21st, 2004, 19:21
For Koitten, Bron and Colleenyb,

* As the sounds of applause and manic cheers echo through the net...*

Oh, hear hear! Well said. What a fabulous attitude! I hereby resolve to emulate your enlightened attitudes and make the three of you my new messiahs!

Okay, not that over the top, but it's good to see women not being intimidated by the legions of bad stories and whatnot being bandied about. I have friends who, upon hearing that I'm moving to Japan suddenly get this funny look on their face and say "But aren't the guys all...you know?!" After rolling my eyes and pointing out the overabundance of you know in our local aussie males, I remind them that I'm not going for the men, I'm going to experience a culture completly different to my own!

If I was going for the guys, I'd be off to Sweden..... :wink:

Cantdosleepflower
May 22nd, 2004, 00:38
The final line in the http://www.debito.org/genderissues.html article is an absolute killer:



"PS: Ladies, if you think Japan is a desert for male relationships, I suggest you go to another island society--Britain--and feel the mirror image. A huge number of dumpy, sarky women for the American man, but lots of well-dressed, eloquent and charming men for you. Britain is an American woman's paradise. Ask my mother."


The man's his own very special kind of genius. Ask his mother.

colleenyb
May 22nd, 2004, 02:05
Well, happyjadebuddah, you seem like quite a friendly guy (sarcasm doesn't carry over too well electronically). I hope you are not so crass and quick to pass judgement on the people you meet in Japan. And I sincerely hope that I won't be one of the people you meet in Japan.

I am better than the guy who only dates asians because I'm open to all nationalities and don't limit myself to specific types of people for selfish reasons.

Also, I don't know where you got that I had sex with the Japanese guy by reading my post. I was just making a joke about giving them beers- it was actually him who bought me the beers.

I'm glad some of the others appreciated my humor. I'm just trying to bring some optimism to us ladies about our love lives, or lackthereof as some predict, in Japan.

topsterloin
May 22nd, 2004, 03:59
how about some interracial itil group make-up sex when we get to japan? cause, baby...it ain't that serious; we all love each other here, right? :wink:

philmine1
May 22nd, 2004, 04:34
Colleenyb, don't take happyjadebuddha seriously, he's actually very likable :P

Topsterloin, NO, just no (I saw your pic, hehehe)

adammoogle
May 22nd, 2004, 05:35
i wanted to post on here cos everyone else did and i felt left out. :roll:

also, i couldn't be bothered to read all the other posts to see what buddha said (man you guys hav been busy!) but i say we can all settle our differences through the time honoured tradition of getting roaring drunk, shouting alot, head butting each other for a bit, then laying down in an exhasuted heap before a minute or so of hugging and crying

:mrgreen:

i would also like to point out that i am always free if anyone needs a hug :)

or if thats not your cup of tea you can stroke Katherines hedgehog, its flea free! :D

colleenyb
May 22nd, 2004, 06:19
Yes, Philmine 1, I have now been told by several people not to get offended by Happyjadebuddah and will not take him seriously in the future.

On another note, you have just made me very happy because I realized you have your picture of John Turturro as Jesus Quintana. He is so damn funny. :)

I suppose I should get around to putting a picture up since I am sitting at my boring office job all day. I doubt I could top your picture though.

HappyJadeBuddha
May 22nd, 2004, 13:52
I'll bet I could top Phil's picture, but I'm sure it would be taken down as soon as it was posted.


Thanks for coming to my rescue, Phil, even if it wasn't needed. I've been doing a pretty good job fending off the whiny old hellbeasts with this here bar stool.


As for being likable, I really could care less. If someone is full of shit, I call them on it. I expect nothing less from others in return.

Colleen, you may not want to meet me, but in case you do the Zima's on me.

philmine1
May 22nd, 2004, 15:32
Duffy - you are almost edible in your likeableness.

Colleenyb - You know this zero-to-hero thing? Does it work in reverse? Not saying that I'm a stud or anything, just curious.

I have an exam in 89 minutes and I know absolutely nothing.

HappyJadeBuddha
May 22nd, 2004, 16:01
Good luck on your exam, phil.

koitten
May 22nd, 2004, 16:52
philmine 1 - The power of positive thinking. Gambatte!

Beq - Don't know that I'm quite a messiah... but if you ever need any support and encouragement, I'm there for you. Actually, I'm a goddess - that's my best way to describe that inner self-esteem. Kind of a Yoga thing, I guess.

And like any group of men - there are those who make up for their you know in very pleasing ways. :wink:

Oh - here's a few book titles (can't say I've read'em but they're respected by the foreign female community)
Being a Broad in Japan
Womansword: What Japanese Words Say About Women (the origin of "ko itten", and other terms) by Kittredge Cherry
Onna Rashiku (Like a Woman): The Diary of a Language Learner in Japan by Karen Ogulnick

And a book for all
Dogs and Demons - an excellent look at the socioeconomic aspects of Japan

topsterloin
May 23rd, 2004, 12:36
Topsterloin, NO, just no (I saw your pic, hehehe)

don't worry, philmine...the invite was definitely not intended for you (i've seen your pic as well :lol: ); hope the test went alright...i've always found after the fact that exams turn out better when you DON'T know s***!

colleenyb
May 25th, 2004, 02:11
Hi guys,

Hope you all had a nice weekend. I was fortunate enough to meet a lovely Japanese exchange student from Tokyo Saturday night who's wanting to do a language exchange. I need all the help I can get with my Japanese and he wants help with his English. A language exchange is a good idea for us who have school loans to repay and can't afford a tutor. I suggest putting an ad on Craig's list or something.

Phil, about the 'zero-to-hero' working in reverse, that would be a tragedy. I honestly have no idea how likely it is in Japan. Perhaps you could go from hero to superhero, in which case I'd expect to see you in a cape. :D

philmine1
May 25th, 2004, 02:16
Phil, about the 'zero-to-hero' working in reverse, that would be a tragedy. I honestly have no idea how likely it is in Japan. Perhaps you could go from hero to superhero, in which case I'd expect to see you in a cape. :D

Haha! I actually got told I looked like a "superstar" by a random pissed bloke in the pub the other day so you never know, I'll bring a cape just in case :lol:

You take care of yourself young lady

Phil
xxxxx