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Thread: Grammar question

  1. #1

    Default Grammar question

    Which is correct?

    The boy laughing is bob.
    The laughing boy is bob.

  2. #2
    Gizmoduck - blatherskite Gizmotech's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    The laughing boy is bob
    The boy who is laughing is bob
    Quote Originally Posted by Cytrix View Post
    Organising anything with ALTs is like herding cats on catnip

    Quote Originally Posted by Antonath View Post
    We Jeeperneez are express all emotion through money. Wedding is happy money. Funeral is sad money. Izakaya is friendship money. Girl-bar is almost-sex money. But babby-borning is bery happy money, as no babby in Japan. All babby is special so we is givings much money as presento for babby.

  3. #3

    Default

    Does it work for the reduced relative?

    The boy (who is) laughing is bob.

  4. #4
    Gizmoduck - blatherskite Gizmotech's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    with commas yes,

    The boy, laughing, is bob.

    "The boy laughing is bob" is not a grammatical statement in my head because in no way can boy be turned into something which can describe laughing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cytrix View Post
    Organising anything with ALTs is like herding cats on catnip

    Quote Originally Posted by Antonath View Post
    We Jeeperneez are express all emotion through money. Wedding is happy money. Funeral is sad money. Izakaya is friendship money. Girl-bar is almost-sex money. But babby-borning is bery happy money, as no babby in Japan. All babby is special so we is givings much money as presento for babby.

  5. #5
    Senior Member zero's Avatar
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    Default

    Bob

  6. #6
    Resident ewok wicket's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    They are both correct. In the first example 'who is' is implied.

    Think about another example.
    The girl standing [ in the corner] is Jane.
    The standing girl is Jane.
    "Like anyone with a sliver of honesty in them I believe what I find I believe when I wake up each morning."
    Stephen Fry, The stars' tennis balls

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    Gizmoduck - blatherskite Gizmotech's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    Hmm.... I knew I was wrong but I cannot make the your reduction work in my head. It sends off EVERY YUCK bell I have. If you have the preposition phrase in there, sure, it works just fine reduced.... which is why I knew I was wrong, BUT "The boy laughing is...." The girl standing is...." both of them make my head spin.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cytrix View Post
    Organising anything with ALTs is like herding cats on catnip

    Quote Originally Posted by Antonath View Post
    We Jeeperneez are express all emotion through money. Wedding is happy money. Funeral is sad money. Izakaya is friendship money. Girl-bar is almost-sex money. But babby-borning is bery happy money, as no babby in Japan. All babby is special so we is givings much money as presento for babby.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Grammar question

    My JTE took issue with it. She said she was taught, that if you had no words following "laughing" then it goes in front of "boy." So basically you use "laughing" as an adjective if it is stands a lone and use it as a reduced clause if it is part of a phrase like "the boy laughing at the teacher."

  9. #9
    Resident ewok wicket's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gizmotech View Post
    Hmm.... I knew I was wrong but I cannot make the your reduction work in my head. It sends off EVERY YUCK bell I have. If you have the preposition phrase in there, sure, it works just fine reduced.... which is why I knew I was wrong, BUT "The boy laughing is...." The girl standing is...." both of them make my head spin.
    It sounds weird, granted, but it's grammatically correct. Kind of like saying, "I wish I WERE not working at a stupid Japanese school." is grammatically correct even though it might sound strange.

    Your answer implied that the boy was only Bob if and when he was laughing.
    "Like anyone with a sliver of honesty in them I believe what I find I believe when I wake up each morning."
    Stephen Fry, The stars' tennis balls

  10. #10
    Gizmoduck - blatherskite Gizmotech's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    Your subjunctive example doesn't make my head spin at all. I can exchange both was and were for that statement w/o any problem (though I strongly prefer was), and I can generate both sentences fine.

    When I say yuck bells, I mean I can't even generate that reduced sentence, and I agree w/ jwkelly's JTE.... I wouldn't reduce it down to a single progressive like that.... it would have to have a preposition phrase with it, or it would have to keep the "who is".
    Quote Originally Posted by Cytrix View Post
    Organising anything with ALTs is like herding cats on catnip

    Quote Originally Posted by Antonath View Post
    We Jeeperneez are express all emotion through money. Wedding is happy money. Funeral is sad money. Izakaya is friendship money. Girl-bar is almost-sex money. But babby-borning is bery happy money, as no babby in Japan. All babby is special so we is givings much money as presento for babby.

  11. #11
    Resident ewok wicket's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    in my example, was would be grammatically incorrect.
    "Like anyone with a sliver of honesty in them I believe what I find I believe when I wake up each morning."
    Stephen Fry, The stars' tennis balls

  12. #12
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gizmotech View Post
    Your subjunctive example doesn't make my head spin at all. I can exchange both was and were for that statement w/o any problem (though I strongly prefer was), and I can generate both sentences fine.

    When I say yuck bells, I mean I can't even generate that reduced sentence, and I agree w/ jwkelly's JTE.... I wouldn't reduce it down to a single progressive like that.... it would have to have a preposition phrase with it, or it would have to keep the "who is".
    English grammar is, pretty much, a joke. When you can construct sentences like : "Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo." and "James, while John had had "had", had had "had had"; "had had" had had a better effect on the teacher." and have them be grammatically correct, arguing about whether a sentence is grammatical is less important than whether a sentence's meaning can be easily discerned.
    I.e., proper grammar doesn't really mean that something makes sense, it just means that it conforms to the rather arbitrary and loose rules which English uses.

    So I think I agree with you and the JTE, though not about it being wrong.

  13. #13

    Default

    I think a lot of the problems arise due to the fact many of the sentences are being made outside of context.

    thank you
    Last edited by jwkelley; October 25th, 2012 at 13:19.

  14. #14
    chill yo coop52's Avatar
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    Default Re: Grammar question

    "due to the fact," dude.

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